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Post by New Here on Feb 12, 2017 1:14:07 GMT
Is anyone else yet fed up enough that at least a few of us could get together and retain competent council for a real Franchisee Association to protect us a bit from these predatory practices corporate is guilty of? I've about had it with all the mistakes in fitware, the wrong billings, the giving away of our club equipment wear and tear without our approval, our inability to cancel a "trial" membership, and what I believe is illegal accounting methods as there is no real breakdown of what they are billing for nor what they are reimbursing for on our monthly statements. No accounting firm in the world would allow this ridiculous method of accounting they have and I suspect some Attorney General's in various states would be interested in how this is being done.
I hear an awful lot of disappointment but I see no one wanting to pony up a few dollars that could very well make the difference between decent profitability and closing the doors.
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Post by Tired Franchisee on Feb 13, 2017 19:45:31 GMT
I have responded that IM IN to Pony up for An Association. Once someone starts the conversation; they disappear. I wonder if Snap corp is hushing them.
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Post by determined1 on Feb 23, 2017 14:02:20 GMT
I spoke with our attorney about setting up a franchisee association. What they said is that you'd want to have about 50% of the franchisees on board. The minimum they'd recommend would be 30%. I wouldn't begin to estimate how many franchisees there are. On the board here I'm guessing we probably have about 10.
So the question is how do you gather a list of how many franchisees there are who would join?
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Post by snaplongtimer on Feb 23, 2017 16:52:36 GMT
I am pretty sure a club would want to be reasonably successful to participate in this or at least see a future in the coming years. With my one club struggling as it is, I seem to be more focused on how good it's going to feel to part ways more than anything. I struggle with my surrounding degrading area and the half dozen clubs that set up around me in addition to my enormous tax burden in a declining neighborhood. That being said, do you think the dues for something like this would come down the more participants there are?
So I have an idea, but maybe a better idea would come from it. Are most of the club emails available for anyone to see? I imagine one of the previous bulk emails sent out would have that available to us. Rather than send out an email which most clubs would not respond to, what if someone created a survey to send out? Snap sent out a survey once upon a time and I just had to submit my thoughts on how much I would have recommended the franchise to another...not. I wouldn't have done it by email. Survey Monkey has them free for up to 100 responses containing 10 questions. Perhaps the questions, one by one, could be asked how unhappy zees are with each topic and finally ask toward the end would they be interested in participating in a franchisee association with legal representation for example arguing the points highlighted in this survey.
Given there are under 1400 zees minus the corp clubs, could 14 surveys be created and sent out to 100 zees each for free? Contact information could be created with the responses and an estimate could be made to the cost of participating in this association.
Just a thought. Let me know the error of my thoughts and I will flush them down the toilet with my club..
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Post by Larry on Feb 23, 2017 17:29:19 GMT
There are MAYBE 700 clubs left in the US. Maybe 1500 worldwide.
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Post by determined1 on Feb 24, 2017 14:56:28 GMT
snaplongtimer - the FA dues would be dependent on the number participating. Therefore if the initial cost is $5000 for the retainer it would be: 25 franchisees - $200 50 franchisees - $100 100 franchisees - $50 200 franchisees - $25 I think the survey is a good idea. Perhaps a thread to provide good questions would be helpful in selecting questions to gauge the number of franchisees fed up enough to participate. One of the things I'd like to enact is the ability to only allow those franchisees participating in the FA the benefits of the FA. One of the primary goals would be to prevent the destructive actions taken by snap hq. I believe their ultimate goal is to drive every one of their franchisees out of business and then swoop in and pick up the fitness centers for pennies on the dollar. I see this as very much in line with their corporate mindset.
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Post by snaplongtimer on Feb 24, 2017 21:09:44 GMT
So only 700 clubs in the us. I thought I read more on Entrepreneur.com. Something like 930 in y2016.
Corp won't want to buy depreciated, beat up, low performing clubs. The equipment worth is what seems like pennies on the dollar in the open market. The greed won't let them take the risk in a market that hasn't produced for the original franchisee. If they bought a struggling cub for pennies on the dollar that is what they will be selling it for later. I have watched them buy a busy club for a lot of money and when competition edges in they bolt. Never will you see this Franchisor purchase a club surrounded by competition in order to show us dummies how to compete against heavy competition and low priced clubs.
From what I have been reading from some of you, it seems you guys have a better business mind than I when it comes to how the zees may have been taken advantage of. I worry about things like the newer contract I signed that states pretty much I am under their thumb and held hostage to whatever they want to do. In example I believe it says I must go to their conventions. I am in violation of the agreement even if I cannot afford to leave the club or afford the trip. Will they use that against me one day?
Determined does your attorney say he/she could argue many of these points as they stand right now or is this what we basically signed up for? If an attorney argues to disclose the billing fees in detail perhaps corp will say they are working on it. Can we actually force them to adapt standard billing practices to their own software? How about forcing them to incorporate a cc updater? Do they have an obligation to do these things?
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Post by determined1 on Feb 25, 2017 1:48:28 GMT
It's not the non-performing clubs that snap hq wants to pick up for pennies on the dollar, it's the ones doing well. Those struggling they'll let whither on the vine as they concentrate on driving out the owners of the best clubs.
I didn't talk with the attorney about going after snapholes on all of their egregious actions. I was focused on the FA and the requirements. At $300/hour I don't want to dawdle on other topics. Without a FA snap will simply tell you to go fuck yourself, which they've done over and over on EVERY issue brought forth.
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Post by Unhappy on Feb 25, 2017 2:56:53 GMT
Remember one thing, per your franchise agreement, even if you are thriving club and doing well, when it comes time to sell, that is when Corporate will want to buy your club at THEIR price, not what you can actually get on the open market. If they can show the typical market says your club is only worth $100K, it matters not if you have a buyer ready to shell out $400K as corporate has the right of first refusal and while I originally thought that meant they would have to match the price, Nope. That means that they get to take it away from you for what the typical market says it's worth.
This is but one thing that needs to be changed by a very competent franchisee attorney.
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Post by greenergrass on Feb 26, 2017 0:07:17 GMT
700 US club locations? OUCH! This really sucks for us. I know I have lost members because when they travel, they find Planet and Anytime but no Snap Fitness. So sad that I invested in a shitty brand. It's amazing that corporate claims to know what they are doing but they have no idea how to handle the competition successfully except to tell Zs to dump more money into the money pit. Leads are the key. How are we getting our leads?
Corporate invests in NASCAR for some brand recognition. But check out news FROM 2015! Have you read these headlines about NASCAR??! NASCAR & Auto Racing September 29, 2015 3:06 PM NASCAR’s popularity will take another hit with 2016 retirement of Tony Stewart...What Has Happened To The Once High-Flying Sport Of NASCAR?www.forbes.com/sites/.../02/...to-the-once-high-flying-sport-of-nascar (2015 article)....and a Chicago Tribune headline today: NASCAR seeks boost to steep decline with strong Daytona 500.
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Post by snaplongtimer on Feb 27, 2017 16:28:35 GMT
Where does this 700 number come from? On the snap site it says 987. On Entrepreneur.com it says 930 as of year end 2016. These are US clubs.
Corp will always claim they know what they are doing. Every piece of crap they put out they want us to buy and I think we are required to buy under the terms of our agreement. These items are never a hit, yet they will promote it like it's extremely popular and "by popular demand". They have to tell you everything is awesome and on track in fear of looking incompetent. Plus, there are people that jump on the bandwagon when they tell us everyone thinks it great!
Remember once upon a time when this girl named Jessica, I believe, used to do webinars? I remember someone asked her a question about the poster challenges they sent us with every shape up kit. She jumped on that and said something negative about it like, "you guys aren't participating in it anyway so we stopped it" or something of the like so they discontinued it. That was the most negative comment I have ever heard from the corp office and actually it wasn't that negative, but only the truth. Incidentally, I nearly got my ass kicked in my one gym trying to get meatheads to participate in it. Embarrassing, but I've learned.
Oh...Nascar, I still cannot find a member that has seen our snap car in a race. That driver must be finishing last...
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Post by isthisheaven on Feb 5, 2018 22:14:16 GMT
I am very interested in the FA. Has this passed or is everyone still looking to do this?
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Post by cheryl on Feb 5, 2018 23:33:53 GMT
There's interest, but it's the organizing which is difficult. I'd suggest having a meeting during the snap convention since people are being forced to be there. Hand out flyers to everyone who registers. I'm sure snap will try to run the flyer pusher out of the building. A separate room could be rented to meet, either on-site or off.
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Post by singleman on Feb 6, 2018 22:40:02 GMT
I am very interested in the FA. Has this passed or is everyone still looking to do this?
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Post by singleman on Feb 6, 2018 22:41:03 GMT
I've spoken with a couple lawyers at a couple different firms about creating a franchisee association. The retainer is between $5K to $7.5K I've become so frustrated with the incompetence of the software which we're paying for dearly in monthly costs and missed revenue, which fitware simply misses as well as the F U attitude from hq that what I'm contemplating is just laying out the retainer myself. Those who elect to take part can send a check for $100 to the law firm. I figure that's 75 franchisees. If there are more then the price would come down and franchisees could elect to have the difference returned or put into a franchisee fund. I'll provide details as I move down this path. If others have a better idea I'm game. I'd prefer to put the money into new equipment, but this would give me peace of mind, which I haven't really had the entire time I've owned this franchise, except maybe for the first 6 months.
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